[cpt_chris]

Using the difficulty in catching file sharers as the primary justification is like arguing that murder should be legalized because not all murder cases are solved.

i get the analogy but it really is impossible to moderate the internet without heavily blocking and filtering traffic. a free internet like the one we mutually agree should exist is incompatible with one where even a single person is punished for transferring copyrighted files. as for the scope of the 'crimes', there a billions of file sharers to put on trial and only a few thousand murderers. the same murder analogy used when one suggests legalizing drugs. we can't stop drug use with authority because it's so widespread so it's best to not criminalize it at all.

[Ayes]

This should be platform #1.

Everyone loves file sharing. File sharing is a positive thing that helps the world be a better place.

Why is this not part of our main platform? We're the pirate party for heck's sake

[Joshua Doucet]

This should be platform #1.

Everyone loves file sharing. File sharing is a positive thing that helps the world be a better place.

Why is this not part of our main platform? We're the pirate party for heck's sake

I agree it would be the most popular topic to lead with. Canadians want to hear about the issue of file sharing. If I was ever trying to sell the pirate party to someone I would ask them if they have an mp3 player (which nearly everyone has) I"d ask them how many songs they have and where they downloaded them(could be 1000's and normally downloaded free) and then I could say. Imagine if you paid a dollar for each song, would you have spent 1000 dollars for all those songs even since you can copy 1 song a thousand times at no cost?

I think that would sell it to anyone age 30 and below.

[Mikkel Paulson]

It's there, but it's not front and centre. Why? Because it's redundant. As you say, we're the Pirate Party. If we say that we're for non-commercial file sharing in press interviews, they will talk about nothing else. We have much more to offer to a much broader range of people, which means that our larger platform needs to get the most attention.

[Ayes]

It's there, but it's not front and centre. Why? Because it's redundant. As you say, we're the Pirate Party. If we say that we're for non-commercial file sharing in press interviews, they will talk about nothing else. We have much more to offer to a much broader range of people, which means that our larger platform needs to get the most attention.

I don't buy that we should worry about redundancy. We have to play to the lowest common denominator. For every one person who understands Net Neutrality there are ten who love to download music and movies for themselves and their family for non commercial purposes.

If we are redundant, people will understand. Our platform is logical and worthwhile and deserves lots of votes and support. We need someone who can debate the details when it comes down to it, but in our advertising we should use broad strokes that will attract an audience. We could base our platform on being "so much more than just filesharing" but I think it's absurd to not have filesharing front and center. We're the pirate party.

People are going to think we're a joke if we don't stand up for filesharing.

[Joshua Doucet]

Point ^

[Rintaran]

Ayes, you have a beautiful slogan hidden in there!

So much more than filesharing

This slogan puts filesharing front-and-center for people to see, but forces them to say "Really? What else do you stand for?" .   I agree with Mikkel that there's no point to purposefully and boisterously beat the file-sharing drum, but we can certainly leverage it as a slogan, or advertising tag-line, to get people asking about our platform. I think that's something the PR Committee should consider.

[JasonCarr]

Here the problem....

If we allow the focus to shift away from file-sharing to our other platform points that we will become a bogus abstract party that doesn't really stand for anything.

Privacy, for example, only really matters when you have something to hide. Sure we all recognize it as an objectively important issue but it really doesn't hit home until our livelihood requires it. For pirates, privacy matters when we are illegally downloading. The same for net neutrality, we all know that it is something intrinsically valuable but what really matters to us is that our torrents are not throttled. Anti-censorship and freedom of speech pertain to the right of torrent websites to provide us with meta-data. These are all important ideas outside of the private party but without real world applications they are just abstractions. The pirate party provides these real world correlates when we advocate file-sharing.

The current threat to this is people with anti-file sharing agendas that join the pirate party under the guise of  our other platform points and then proceed to dilute our mandate by over-emphasizing things like anti-censorship and privacy while quietly arguing against file-sharing. I can only imagine these folks spreading anti-file sharing rhetoric with the massing looking at them and going "He is a member of the pirate party and even he is against downloading, who are we to argue".

These elements already exist in our party and if we don't strongly advocate file-sharing as our main issue, they are only going to become more numerous.

[trailblazer11]

No need to be too specific about everything in our platform. Instead, our platform should oppose any restriction and censorship imposed on any emerging / established technology. This would include filesharing technology. Filesharing technology could be compared to the World Wide Web. When web started, it was used as collaboration tools by scientist, now it has widespread applications. Of course filesharing technology such as torrent have many advantages over other technology like ftp.  So it is a technology with great potential and it would be a shame to outlaw it. It just does not make sense unless you are a lobbyist for the stubborn old school major labels.

But it does not make sense to name a specific technology on our platform.

[Ayes]

No need to be too specific about everything in our platform. Instead, our platform should oppose any restriction and censorship imposed on any emerging / established technology.

I like the idea of being all about allowing technology to live up to it's potential.

[Mikkel Paulson]

Privacy, for example, only really matters when you have something to hide.

No. No. No no no no no no. Privacy matters to everyone, and everyone has something to hide from someone. Sure some value it more than others, but few people would argue with the importance of privacy.

I like the idea of being all about allowing technology to live up to it's potential.

Absolutely. One point I often make when speaking to the media is that the current prevailing school of thought in government and big business is trying to fit the Internet into their existing business models, not unlike approaching the printing press and only using it for illuminating manuscripts rather than embracing its full revolutionary potential. We want to climb aboard this new cultural revolution and see where it takes us. I think even now, 40 years later, we're only seeing the tip of the iceberg in terms of the social effects of the Internet.


I do support pushing the filesharing aspect of our platform more. Until now, I've been focusing on selling other aspects of our platform in an attempt to broaden our member base/appeal rather than dedicating ourselves to one niche group that will never alone get us elected. However, we can certainly do more to reach out to the people who take the importance of our platform for granted.

[JasonCarr]

Privacy matters to everyone, and everyone has something to hide from someone. Sure some value it more than others, but few people would argue with the importance of privacy.

Congrats Mikkel, you just turned my premise into a perfect syllogism. If privacy only matters when you have something to hide and if everyone has something to hide then privacy matters to everyone. Doesn't prove my premise, I will admit, but it does leave open the possibility then you and I are not actually in a disagreement over the subject.

[Concerned Citizen]

Just ask that lady who some rogers rep tied her cell phone in her maiden name and such to her normal bill and sent it to the house... She was using that phone to cheat on her husband and he found out

Privacy is important. Without it you would not have your rights against unreasonable search and seizure and the government could just roll up whenever they please and go through your belongings.

Government Transparency is important because the more a government is able to hide the less accountable they become to the people they are supposed to represent.

i like to think that we're a forward party and not get bogged down with the directions of left and right like other parties have.